David Jones has kindly forwarded a copy of his letter to us. Please see below.
BRYN EURYN NATURE RESERVE
I have been consulted by a large number of local residents with regard to the management committee’s proposals for the future of Bryn Euryn nature reserve.
I see that at the last meeting of the committee, the principle of ‘management through grazing’ was agreed and that it was resolved that ‘proposals/options be investigated and further considered’.
I must tell you that the proposal to graze Bryn Euryn has caused severe concern to my constituents. On Saturday last week, a meeting was held at the nature reserve’s car park, which was attended by up to 200 residents. The overwhelming view of those present was that the proposal was most unwelcome, in that it would severely inhibit the freedom of walkers to enjoy the reserve.
I understand that it has been contended that Bryn Euryn has been grazed in the past. A number of senior people present last Saturday (one with over 70 years’ knowledge of the Bryn) assured me that they could not recall any part of the Bryn Euryn reserve ever having been grazed in living memory.
Concern was also expressed as to the danger to walkers and their dogs, the cost of erecting and maintaining fencing and, generally, the fact that Bryn Euryn would be a far less pleasant place of resort for local residents.
I have no doubt that the management committee meant well when it proposed that Bryn Euryn be grazed. However, I can assure you that the proposal is very unwelcome indeed and is causing a great deal of unhappiness to a large number of people.
Given that Bryn Euryn is meant to be a place of leisure for local residents, and given the very high strength of local feeling over the issue, I would urge that the management committee, at its next meeting, give full consideration to the likely impact of the proposal upon residents and to the fact that a significantly large sample of those residents have already amply demonstrated their opposition by consulting their local councillors and Member of Parliament and attending a meeting on a wet Saturday morning.
I therefore would strongly suggest that the committee review its decision and abandon the proposal.
I look forward to hearing from you in early course please.
Yours sincerely,
Monday 29 June 2009
Sunday 28 June 2009
Huge Turnout for Rally Against Grazing
From David Jones' Blog site: -
Well, there was an excellent turn-out at Bryn Euryn car park today, despite the weather; about 200 people and probably almost half as many dogs.
Many of the older people who attended told me that, contrary to the claims of the management committee, they could not remember livestock ever having been grazed on the Bryn.
Local county councillors Roger Parry and Merfyn Thomas also turned up and confirmed they would be doing everything they could to stop the unpopular plan.
I’ll be writing to the committee next week, but in the meantime am posting a picture of just a few of the humans and canines who attended.
Many of the older people who attended told me that, contrary to the claims of the management committee, they could not remember livestock ever having been grazed on the Bryn.
Local county councillors Roger Parry and Merfyn Thomas also turned up and confirmed they would be doing everything they could to stop the unpopular plan.
I’ll be writing to the committee next week, but in the meantime am posting a picture of just a few of the humans and canines who attended.
Thanks to must also go to local Blogger, Thoughts of Oscar for his reports, People Power sums it up!
Thanks also to http://www.birdseyeviewofwales.co.uk/ for taking the aerial photographs of the rally, free of charge, we'll post some as soon as we work out how!
Have Your Say Questionnaire
Save Our Bryn supporters produced a little questionnaire for the public meeting called by David Jones MP yesterday.
There's still more to come in as not everyone there had a chance to fill one in (the huge turnout resulted in a shortage of pens), also many supporters couldn't make the meeting. So far we have counted over 130 completed, all against grazing on the Bryn, bar one in favour but this may have been a mistake!
Final figures will be confirmed when counting is finished but so far the vast majority of those who completed the questionnaire are also in favour of the creation of a Bryn Euryn User Association and in favour of this Association being represented on the council's Bryn Euryn Management Committee.
A good number of those who completed the questionnaire have also asked to become a Member of the Bryn Euryn User Association.
Saving the Bryn is set to be on-going and best achieved by an association of those who actually use it, hopefully working with the council's management committee.
There is a copy of the questionnaire below, feel free to complete with YES or NO to each question and email to save.our.bryn@hotmail.co.uk
Thanks to all who turned up with special thanks to David Jones MP for arranging and councillors Merfyn Thomas and Roger Parry for showing their support.
SAVE OUR BRYN – HAVE YOUR SAY
I object to the proposals to introduce livestock grazing to the open spaces on Bryn Euryn
I support the creation of the Bryn Euryn User Association
I think the Bryn Euryn Management Committee should include representatives of the Bryn Euryn User Association; meetings should be open to the public and minutes made available
I would like to become a Member of the Bryn Euryn User Association (Membership free just fill in your details below)
Name: …………………………………………………...
Address: . …………………………………………………..
……………………Telephone: …………………
Email: (should you wish to receive updates) ………..……@..........
There's still more to come in as not everyone there had a chance to fill one in (the huge turnout resulted in a shortage of pens), also many supporters couldn't make the meeting. So far we have counted over 130 completed, all against grazing on the Bryn, bar one in favour but this may have been a mistake!
Final figures will be confirmed when counting is finished but so far the vast majority of those who completed the questionnaire are also in favour of the creation of a Bryn Euryn User Association and in favour of this Association being represented on the council's Bryn Euryn Management Committee.
A good number of those who completed the questionnaire have also asked to become a Member of the Bryn Euryn User Association.
Saving the Bryn is set to be on-going and best achieved by an association of those who actually use it, hopefully working with the council's management committee.
There is a copy of the questionnaire below, feel free to complete with YES or NO to each question and email to save.our.bryn@hotmail.co.uk
Thanks to all who turned up with special thanks to David Jones MP for arranging and councillors Merfyn Thomas and Roger Parry for showing their support.
SAVE OUR BRYN – HAVE YOUR SAY
I object to the proposals to introduce livestock grazing to the open spaces on Bryn Euryn
I support the creation of the Bryn Euryn User Association
I think the Bryn Euryn Management Committee should include representatives of the Bryn Euryn User Association; meetings should be open to the public and minutes made available
I would like to become a Member of the Bryn Euryn User Association (Membership free just fill in your details below)
Name: …………………………………………………...
Address: . …………………………………………………..
……………………Telephone: …………………
Email: (should you wish to receive updates) ………..……@..........
Friday 26 June 2009
Press Release from the Council
The council press release below has been forwarded by supporters of Save Our Bryn. Two things which stand out, the first isn't the most sustainable solution to do nothing and let nature take its course, something I understand is favoured by some boffins.
The second point, ensuring concerns are based on correct information, this is something that has upset many supporters who claim there is no history of grazing for the last 60 years!
There was a hill fort up there in the past, does that mean the council could put an army base up there now if they wished! It's the same logic as introducing grazing and the army might even control some of the asbo trouble makers!
Press Release
Bryn Euryn is managed as a Local Nature Reserve, and a Site of Special Scientific Interest for its fantastic limestone grasslands; as such a balance needs to be struck to manage the area for public enjoyment and for nature conservation.
The Management Advisory Group for Bryn Euryn takes very seriously this responsibility and as a group consisting of councillors, representatives from the Countryside Council for Wales, the Civic Society and Archaeological Trust to which staff from Conwy Countryside Service report, they have agreed to look into the feasibility of introducing grazing livestock to some areas of the Bryn for short periods of the year.
Cllr Dave Roberts, Chair of the Management Advisory Group said:
“I am extremely aware how important this site is to the local people, the site has been grazed by livestock in the past, and we are simply looking into the feasibility of returning grazing to this site. This does not have to mean that public access on the Bryn would be restricted; public access will of course be one of the considerations within the feasibility exercise for this.
Whilst I appreciate the public concern, I am also aware of the need to manage the Bryn in a sustainable way for future generations to enjoy the wildflowers at this amazing site. The limestone grasslands require management and as a group we are investigating the methods available for this.
It is expected that the feasibility exercise will include some form of public consultation to take on board the local feeling; however this consultation would also need to assure that local people are basing their concerns on correct information.”
END
Editor’s Note
Cllr Dave Roberts is Chair of the Management Advisory Group for Bryn Euryn and a County Councillor for Rhos-on-Sea.
The second point, ensuring concerns are based on correct information, this is something that has upset many supporters who claim there is no history of grazing for the last 60 years!
There was a hill fort up there in the past, does that mean the council could put an army base up there now if they wished! It's the same logic as introducing grazing and the army might even control some of the asbo trouble makers!
Press Release
Bryn Euryn is managed as a Local Nature Reserve, and a Site of Special Scientific Interest for its fantastic limestone grasslands; as such a balance needs to be struck to manage the area for public enjoyment and for nature conservation.
The Management Advisory Group for Bryn Euryn takes very seriously this responsibility and as a group consisting of councillors, representatives from the Countryside Council for Wales, the Civic Society and Archaeological Trust to which staff from Conwy Countryside Service report, they have agreed to look into the feasibility of introducing grazing livestock to some areas of the Bryn for short periods of the year.
Cllr Dave Roberts, Chair of the Management Advisory Group said:
“I am extremely aware how important this site is to the local people, the site has been grazed by livestock in the past, and we are simply looking into the feasibility of returning grazing to this site. This does not have to mean that public access on the Bryn would be restricted; public access will of course be one of the considerations within the feasibility exercise for this.
Whilst I appreciate the public concern, I am also aware of the need to manage the Bryn in a sustainable way for future generations to enjoy the wildflowers at this amazing site. The limestone grasslands require management and as a group we are investigating the methods available for this.
It is expected that the feasibility exercise will include some form of public consultation to take on board the local feeling; however this consultation would also need to assure that local people are basing their concerns on correct information.”
END
Editor’s Note
Cllr Dave Roberts is Chair of the Management Advisory Group for Bryn Euryn and a County Councillor for Rhos-on-Sea.
Thursday 25 June 2009
North Wales Weekly News
http://www.northwalesweeklynews.co.uk/conwy-county-news/local-conwy-news/2009/06/25/dog-walkers-fear-loss-of-rhos-on-sea-nature-reserve-to-livestock-55243-23966939/
Dog walkers fear loss of Rhos-on-Sea nature reserve to livestock
Jun 25 2009 by Richard Evans, North Wales Weekly News
DOG walkers fear they could lose a popular beauty spot because of council plans to graze livestock at a nature reserve to cut costs.
Bryn Euryn in Rhos-on-Sea is used by hundreds of pet owners from early mornings to dusk as an ideal location to relax and enjoy breathtaking scenery.
But a protest group now fears the reserve could be lost to those walking dogs if horses, ponies or sheep are introduced to the land.
A council advisory group is looking at the prospect of grazing animals there, sparking worries that dogs will be banned or large areas fenced off.
The area is a Site of Special Scientific Interest because of its limestone grasslands and the council says the grass needs to be managed sustainably.
The Weekly News spoke to several concerned dog owners at the popular walking spot.
Keith Butler, 73, of Dinerth Avenue, Rhos--on-Sea was walking his two dogs with his wife Menai.
“If you stand here from 6am-9pm there would literally be hundreds of people walking, there’s a tremendous number of people who walk their dogs up here,” he said.
“They would have to fence off the area. If dogs were left to wander round they might attack the livestock and cause problems.”
Liz Hamel is from Upper Colwyn Bay and runs Valley Dog Training, based in Llandudno Junction.
She said: “I think it is disgraceful, we need places to exercise our dogs. They need free running for their health and a lot of elderly people need the area for somewhere to meet and exercise.
“If there’s livestock you’ll have to keep dogs on a lead, and they are not going to get any exercise. It’s a stupid idea.”
Russell Musgrove, 40, of Rhos Road, Rhos-on-Sea was walking his dogs.
“I would like to see it stay open land, I wouldn’t take the dogs up here if there was livestock. I wouldn’t want the dogs to be afraid or livestock frightened.”
Rhos-on-Sea councillor Dave Roberts is chairman of the group that runs the reserve: “I am aware how important this site is to people.
“The site has been grazed by livestock in the past and we are simply looking into the feasibility of returning grazing to this site.
“This does not have to mean public access would be restricted.
“I’m also aware of the need to manage the Bryn sustainably for future generations.”
Cllr Roberts said there would be a public consultation process.
A public meeting will take place at Bryn Euryn car park at 10.30am this Saturday.
Dog walkers fear loss of Rhos-on-Sea nature reserve to livestock
Jun 25 2009 by Richard Evans, North Wales Weekly News
DOG walkers fear they could lose a popular beauty spot because of council plans to graze livestock at a nature reserve to cut costs.
Bryn Euryn in Rhos-on-Sea is used by hundreds of pet owners from early mornings to dusk as an ideal location to relax and enjoy breathtaking scenery.
But a protest group now fears the reserve could be lost to those walking dogs if horses, ponies or sheep are introduced to the land.
A council advisory group is looking at the prospect of grazing animals there, sparking worries that dogs will be banned or large areas fenced off.
The area is a Site of Special Scientific Interest because of its limestone grasslands and the council says the grass needs to be managed sustainably.
The Weekly News spoke to several concerned dog owners at the popular walking spot.
Keith Butler, 73, of Dinerth Avenue, Rhos--on-Sea was walking his two dogs with his wife Menai.
“If you stand here from 6am-9pm there would literally be hundreds of people walking, there’s a tremendous number of people who walk their dogs up here,” he said.
“They would have to fence off the area. If dogs were left to wander round they might attack the livestock and cause problems.”
Liz Hamel is from Upper Colwyn Bay and runs Valley Dog Training, based in Llandudno Junction.
She said: “I think it is disgraceful, we need places to exercise our dogs. They need free running for their health and a lot of elderly people need the area for somewhere to meet and exercise.
“If there’s livestock you’ll have to keep dogs on a lead, and they are not going to get any exercise. It’s a stupid idea.”
Russell Musgrove, 40, of Rhos Road, Rhos-on-Sea was walking his dogs.
“I would like to see it stay open land, I wouldn’t take the dogs up here if there was livestock. I wouldn’t want the dogs to be afraid or livestock frightened.”
Rhos-on-Sea councillor Dave Roberts is chairman of the group that runs the reserve: “I am aware how important this site is to people.
“The site has been grazed by livestock in the past and we are simply looking into the feasibility of returning grazing to this site.
“This does not have to mean public access would be restricted.
“I’m also aware of the need to manage the Bryn sustainably for future generations.”
Cllr Roberts said there would be a public consultation process.
A public meeting will take place at Bryn Euryn car park at 10.30am this Saturday.
Response to the wardens reply
Dear Alun
Thank you for your email of 24th June 2009 in response to mine of 17th June 2009.
I am grateful for the answers to the questions you have provided and trust answers to the remaining will follow when you have the information required. In the meantime I have been asked to relay to you the following comments.
History of Grazing
It seems clear there is no evidence of historic grazing in living memory. Older residents and supporters of those wishing to keep the Bryn as an unrestricted, open public space confirm, no grazing in at least the last 60 years. The current use of the Bryn, as a public open space, rather than grazing land, is surely now firmly established and this is no doubt its legal use, in Planning terms? If the proposing grazing does proceed the public open space will be lost as the two uses are not compatible. I imagine introduction of grazing would require planning permission, as was the case with the change of use of the bottom field into allotments?
Site of Special Scientific Interest
As you will be aware, calcareous grasses are typically associated with limestone pavements and outcrops. The process by which calcareous grasslands becomes overgrown by scrub is part of the normal environmental cycle known as ‘natural succession’. You state ‘the Bryn is a Site of Special Scientific Interest for its calcareous grasslands, which had been maintained by grazing in the past. This interest was being lost by scrubbing over, so since 1996, in partnership with the Countryside Council for Wales, it has been maintained artificially by mowing and raking and cutting back scrub’. As there is no evidence of grazing 50 years prior to the artificial mowing by the council/CCW I would be grateful if you could advise on the relative areas over the years. Has the mowing been artificially maintaining the area of calcareous grass identified in 1996 or has it been increasing the area to perhaps reclaim some of the area lost in the 50 year absence in grazing prior to 1996?
I suspect it is the latter and now this artificial financial burden has been created, cost savings are being considered, the sole reason behind proposals to introduce grazing. Whilst the majority of users of the Bryn support bio-diversity and the like, maintaining an artificially enlarged area of calcareous grass in these difficult times should not be at the loss of the amenity provided by this public open space.
I trust your feasibility study will consider options of reducing the area of grass maintained as well as the frequency of maintaining? Does it really need to be annual?
Management Advisory Group (MAG)
Does the MAG have the authority to totally ignore the wishes of the public following any consultation exercise or would a recommendation by forward for the full council to decide?
Would now perhaps be a good time to formalise terms of reference for the MAG and consider allowing members of the public to be directly represented as local end users of the Bryn? For ease of public access could minutes of meetings (past and present), agendas, meeting dates etc be published on the council’s web site as is the case with many other committees? Allowing members of the public to observe committee meetings would also seem to be in the public interest.
Feasibility Study
Clearly it is early days for your proposals and a detailed feasibility study and comprehensive public consultation will be required before the MAG can make any meaningful decision. Could you advise how much the council expect to pay to prepare the feasibility study. I presume drawings will be provided, planning consultation, legal opinion and specialist consultants will all be required so it won’t be cheap.
How will the lucky precipitant of the free grazing land be determined given the need for the council to be accountable to the public? Is not charging for grazing really sufficient to get around the ‘no business use’ covenant? Before committing too much effort to the feasibility study you might first want to clarify this point?
Health & Safety
I can find no details on the planning application to create allotments, 0/35363 regarding any traffic issues and note the land is managed by another council department but I trust all council departments involved will work together in considering traffic issues to what is a very narrow entrance.
Given the recent tragic storey of a dog walker killed by cattle within the last week, http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/north_yorkshire/8112048.stm, how can the council say anyone using the Bryn whether they be dog walkers, children or the elderly be safe if grazing goes ahead? I trust your feasibility study will include and assessment from the Council’s H&S department with specific reference to the above case and what measures will be put in place to avoid a similar incident, should grazing ever proceed.
There is also the safety issue in respect to any grazing animals considering the numerous instances of anti social behaviour, both in respect to the animals well being and also in relation to any injury incurred by any person under the influence of alcohol or substance abuse.
In closing, I believe that there is sufficient public outrage, concern, risk and information to hand already for the MAG to discount any grazing on the Bryn. To proceed further will result in wasted time and expense.
I hope the MAG dismisses any proposal for grazing at the earliest possibility and considers greater public involvement in its operation
Thank you for your email of 24th June 2009 in response to mine of 17th June 2009.
I am grateful for the answers to the questions you have provided and trust answers to the remaining will follow when you have the information required. In the meantime I have been asked to relay to you the following comments.
History of Grazing
It seems clear there is no evidence of historic grazing in living memory. Older residents and supporters of those wishing to keep the Bryn as an unrestricted, open public space confirm, no grazing in at least the last 60 years. The current use of the Bryn, as a public open space, rather than grazing land, is surely now firmly established and this is no doubt its legal use, in Planning terms? If the proposing grazing does proceed the public open space will be lost as the two uses are not compatible. I imagine introduction of grazing would require planning permission, as was the case with the change of use of the bottom field into allotments?
Site of Special Scientific Interest
As you will be aware, calcareous grasses are typically associated with limestone pavements and outcrops. The process by which calcareous grasslands becomes overgrown by scrub is part of the normal environmental cycle known as ‘natural succession’. You state ‘the Bryn is a Site of Special Scientific Interest for its calcareous grasslands, which had been maintained by grazing in the past. This interest was being lost by scrubbing over, so since 1996, in partnership with the Countryside Council for Wales, it has been maintained artificially by mowing and raking and cutting back scrub’. As there is no evidence of grazing 50 years prior to the artificial mowing by the council/CCW I would be grateful if you could advise on the relative areas over the years. Has the mowing been artificially maintaining the area of calcareous grass identified in 1996 or has it been increasing the area to perhaps reclaim some of the area lost in the 50 year absence in grazing prior to 1996?
I suspect it is the latter and now this artificial financial burden has been created, cost savings are being considered, the sole reason behind proposals to introduce grazing. Whilst the majority of users of the Bryn support bio-diversity and the like, maintaining an artificially enlarged area of calcareous grass in these difficult times should not be at the loss of the amenity provided by this public open space.
I trust your feasibility study will consider options of reducing the area of grass maintained as well as the frequency of maintaining? Does it really need to be annual?
Management Advisory Group (MAG)
Does the MAG have the authority to totally ignore the wishes of the public following any consultation exercise or would a recommendation by forward for the full council to decide?
Would now perhaps be a good time to formalise terms of reference for the MAG and consider allowing members of the public to be directly represented as local end users of the Bryn? For ease of public access could minutes of meetings (past and present), agendas, meeting dates etc be published on the council’s web site as is the case with many other committees? Allowing members of the public to observe committee meetings would also seem to be in the public interest.
Feasibility Study
Clearly it is early days for your proposals and a detailed feasibility study and comprehensive public consultation will be required before the MAG can make any meaningful decision. Could you advise how much the council expect to pay to prepare the feasibility study. I presume drawings will be provided, planning consultation, legal opinion and specialist consultants will all be required so it won’t be cheap.
How will the lucky precipitant of the free grazing land be determined given the need for the council to be accountable to the public? Is not charging for grazing really sufficient to get around the ‘no business use’ covenant? Before committing too much effort to the feasibility study you might first want to clarify this point?
Health & Safety
I can find no details on the planning application to create allotments, 0/35363 regarding any traffic issues and note the land is managed by another council department but I trust all council departments involved will work together in considering traffic issues to what is a very narrow entrance.
Given the recent tragic storey of a dog walker killed by cattle within the last week, http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/north_yorkshire/8112048.stm, how can the council say anyone using the Bryn whether they be dog walkers, children or the elderly be safe if grazing goes ahead? I trust your feasibility study will include and assessment from the Council’s H&S department with specific reference to the above case and what measures will be put in place to avoid a similar incident, should grazing ever proceed.
There is also the safety issue in respect to any grazing animals considering the numerous instances of anti social behaviour, both in respect to the animals well being and also in relation to any injury incurred by any person under the influence of alcohol or substance abuse.
In closing, I believe that there is sufficient public outrage, concern, risk and information to hand already for the MAG to discount any grazing on the Bryn. To proceed further will result in wasted time and expense.
I hope the MAG dismisses any proposal for grazing at the earliest possibility and considers greater public involvement in its operation
Email to the Warden - The Reply
Further the recent email by one of our supporters to the warden, please find below his responce, oringinal email text is black, responce is in red.
Alun
Further to the article on the front page of today’s North Wales Pioneer many of us would be grateful if you could clarify a few points: -
What evidence do you have of recent grazing by livestock? To my own recollection, backed up by several others, there has been no grazing on the Bryn for the last 50 years. If no evidence of recent grazing can be provided will a public apology be forthcoming?
There is a record of it being un-grazed in 1972 and it is a guess that it may have been grazed into the 60s, which is what I said to the Pioneer. It was certainly grazed through the 1930-50s.
Why have contractors been used for the last ten years to mow the land, has this been an artificial attempt to promote the calcareous grasslands?
The Bryn is a Site of Special Scientific Interest for its calcareous grasslands, which had been maintained by grazing in the past. This interest was being lost by scrubbing over , so since 1996, in partnership with the Countryside Council for Wales, it has been maintained artificially by mowing and raking and cutting back scrub.
If no decision has been made, who will make the decision, what timescales do you have, what public consultation do you intend to carryout, what other alternatives to grazing have you considered?
The Management Advisory Group (MAG) has asked us to look into the feasibility of grazing and we are just at the information gathering stage. The MAG will make any decisions, including the form of public consultation. The alternative to grazing is what we are doing now-mowing and scrub control.
You are quoted as saying grazing will be more environmentally friendly in the long run, what criteria have you used to assess the environmental impact? Have you quantified the carbon footprint of transporting livestock to of from site twice a year, carrying materials to form the ‘paddocks’, transporting feed, visits by the livestock owner to inspect their stock? How does this compare to the limited impact of mowing once a year.
We have not yet assessed the carbon footprint of the two options but it is something that may be looked at as part of the feasibility exercise.
How do you proposed to create paddocks without fences, just gates? Will gates provided be suitable for the disabled and families with pushchairs?
We have not yet looked at the detail of what kind of fences and gates would be required.
Regards the management committee Cllr Edwards is a member of, I would be grateful if you could provide the following: -
· Terms of reference for the committee
When the Local Nature Reserve was established in 1996/97, the Council resolved to establish a Management Advisory Group in order to oversee its development and management. There are no detailed terms of reference, but the MAG has one formal meeting each year to review work over the previous year and plan for future years.
· Full list of members with contact addresses
Cllr. D M Roberts,
9 Allanson Rd,
Rhos on Sea,
Colwyn Bay.
LL28 4HN
Cllr M Thomas
7 Dolphin Court
Horton Drive
Rhos on Sea
LL28 4AW
Cllr R E Parry
220 Dinerth Road
Rhos on Sea
Colwyn Bay
LL28 4UH
Cllr Paul Richards(Town Council)
Awelfan
6 Glyn Avenue
Colwyn Bay
LL29 8RB
Cllr Philip R Edwards
6 Whitehall Road
Rhos on Sea
Colwyn Bay
LL28 4HW
Mr Ken Clarke
Contact Conwy Countryside Service.
Dr. J.Osley / Mr Paul Mitchell
CCW,
Glan y Nant
Unit 19
Mold Business Park
Wrexham Road
Mold
Flintshire
CH7 1XP
Dr M Yates
Plas Carew
Unit 5/7
Cefn Coed
Parc Nant Garw
Cardiff
CF15 7QQ
Mr Chris Martin
Clwyd and Powys Archaeological Trust
7a Church St
Welshpool
Powys
SY21 7DL
· Details of how members are appointed and how concerned and interested members of the public can apply to join the committee
The members of the MAG include the county councillors for Rhos on Sea, representatives from CCW, Clwyd Powys Archaeological Trust, CADW, Colwyn Bay Town Council and Colwyn Bay Civic Society and are appointed by invitation. Local people can make representations to the county councillors or town councillors.
· Details of how often the committee meets, date of next meeting, agenda and facilities for members of the public to attend?
The MAG meets formally once a year. This is supplemented by an annual informal site meeting.
· Where can minutes of past meetings be found?
Have attached last minutes. Previous minutes available from Helen Jowett –helen.jowett@conwy.gov.uk.
There are clearly a number of issues which need further investigation and public consultation before any meaningful decision is made, I have listed some below: -
· As you will be aware there is an acute shortage of public open space in Colwyn Bay and it seems at every turn the council is determined to eat into the little which remains. Can you confirm you have considered the loss of the public amenity the open space currently provides? Will the council be providing replacement open space elsewhere?
If it goes ahead there should not be a loss of public open space.
· Has the loss of open space to the proposed allotments been considered before what is left is further eroded?
See above.
· Given there is no recent use of the site for grazing livestock can you provide confirmation from the Planning Committee that Planning permission is not required for ‘change of use’? Please be aware that ‘intensification of use’ is a material ground for the need to apply for Planning permission.
This is to be checked as part of the feasibility exercise.
· Traffic generation, traffic routes, noise generation are all issues which need to be addressed, what size vehicles will transport the proposed livestock, where will they off-load, where will they turn around? Is the track leading up to Llys Euryn Cottage suitable for livestock wagons?
We envisage small numbers of livestock at limited times but we will need to look into this further.
· Has traffic generation the proposed allotments will generate been considered?
The proposed allotment land is not in the control of our department. Traffic generation may well have been considered by our Environmental Services Department in the drafting of the planning application.
· Will a full Environmental Impact Assessment be carried out to support the proposals?
I don’t think one would be required for this scale of project.
· Will a Health and Safety Audit be carried out to identify the increased risks which will be generated and mitigation measures which will be put in place?
Yes, we would need to look at and modify the existing risk assessment.
· Are maps/drawings available showing your proposals in detail? If not I trust they will be made available for public scrutiny as soon as possible?
There are no maps/drwaings yet.
· What will happen to any money made from grazing licenses, will it just go into the council’s central funds or will it be re-invested in the Bryn?
No money will be made from the grazing licences.
· How much will setting up and maintaining these proposals cost in the council’s bureaucratic costs? Can you prove it will actually be cheaper than contractors mowing the grass?
We will be looking at the costs of different options as part of the process.
· Has the use of voluntary workers to control the grass been considered as an alternative?
As it is a big job to mechanically strim and rake the grassland to a high standard involving trained personnel and there is a limited pool of volunteers, we have found it more cost effective to use a contractor.
· We understand the Bryn is managed in trust by Conwy County Council, could you confirm if this is the case? If so can you provide details of any restrictive covenants which are in place? Presumably the Bryn was left as an amenity for the enjoyment and use of the public, is grazing really compatible?
The Bryn is owned by the Council but it does have a covenant. No business use is permitted on the Bryn, which is why we would not charge for any grazing licence.
We trust the council will behave in an appropriate manner, carrying out public consultation and taking on board the concerns of all users of Bryn Euryn?
We will discuss all issues with the MAG, including your concerns. The MAG will make any decisions on what options to pursue and on what form the public consultation should take.
There is a huge groundswell of public opinion against these proposals and should the council not act entirely transparently in this matter we are sure there will be many wishing to take this case to the Local Authority Ombudsman.
Alun
Further to the article on the front page of today’s North Wales Pioneer many of us would be grateful if you could clarify a few points: -
What evidence do you have of recent grazing by livestock? To my own recollection, backed up by several others, there has been no grazing on the Bryn for the last 50 years. If no evidence of recent grazing can be provided will a public apology be forthcoming?
There is a record of it being un-grazed in 1972 and it is a guess that it may have been grazed into the 60s, which is what I said to the Pioneer. It was certainly grazed through the 1930-50s.
Why have contractors been used for the last ten years to mow the land, has this been an artificial attempt to promote the calcareous grasslands?
The Bryn is a Site of Special Scientific Interest for its calcareous grasslands, which had been maintained by grazing in the past. This interest was being lost by scrubbing over , so since 1996, in partnership with the Countryside Council for Wales, it has been maintained artificially by mowing and raking and cutting back scrub.
If no decision has been made, who will make the decision, what timescales do you have, what public consultation do you intend to carryout, what other alternatives to grazing have you considered?
The Management Advisory Group (MAG) has asked us to look into the feasibility of grazing and we are just at the information gathering stage. The MAG will make any decisions, including the form of public consultation. The alternative to grazing is what we are doing now-mowing and scrub control.
You are quoted as saying grazing will be more environmentally friendly in the long run, what criteria have you used to assess the environmental impact? Have you quantified the carbon footprint of transporting livestock to of from site twice a year, carrying materials to form the ‘paddocks’, transporting feed, visits by the livestock owner to inspect their stock? How does this compare to the limited impact of mowing once a year.
We have not yet assessed the carbon footprint of the two options but it is something that may be looked at as part of the feasibility exercise.
How do you proposed to create paddocks without fences, just gates? Will gates provided be suitable for the disabled and families with pushchairs?
We have not yet looked at the detail of what kind of fences and gates would be required.
Regards the management committee Cllr Edwards is a member of, I would be grateful if you could provide the following: -
· Terms of reference for the committee
When the Local Nature Reserve was established in 1996/97, the Council resolved to establish a Management Advisory Group in order to oversee its development and management. There are no detailed terms of reference, but the MAG has one formal meeting each year to review work over the previous year and plan for future years.
· Full list of members with contact addresses
Cllr. D M Roberts,
9 Allanson Rd,
Rhos on Sea,
Colwyn Bay.
LL28 4HN
Cllr M Thomas
7 Dolphin Court
Horton Drive
Rhos on Sea
LL28 4AW
Cllr R E Parry
220 Dinerth Road
Rhos on Sea
Colwyn Bay
LL28 4UH
Cllr Paul Richards(Town Council)
Awelfan
6 Glyn Avenue
Colwyn Bay
LL29 8RB
Cllr Philip R Edwards
6 Whitehall Road
Rhos on Sea
Colwyn Bay
LL28 4HW
Mr Ken Clarke
Contact Conwy Countryside Service.
Dr. J.Osley / Mr Paul Mitchell
CCW,
Glan y Nant
Unit 19
Mold Business Park
Wrexham Road
Mold
Flintshire
CH7 1XP
Dr M Yates
Plas Carew
Unit 5/7
Cefn Coed
Parc Nant Garw
Cardiff
CF15 7QQ
Mr Chris Martin
Clwyd and Powys Archaeological Trust
7a Church St
Welshpool
Powys
SY21 7DL
· Details of how members are appointed and how concerned and interested members of the public can apply to join the committee
The members of the MAG include the county councillors for Rhos on Sea, representatives from CCW, Clwyd Powys Archaeological Trust, CADW, Colwyn Bay Town Council and Colwyn Bay Civic Society and are appointed by invitation. Local people can make representations to the county councillors or town councillors.
· Details of how often the committee meets, date of next meeting, agenda and facilities for members of the public to attend?
The MAG meets formally once a year. This is supplemented by an annual informal site meeting.
· Where can minutes of past meetings be found?
Have attached last minutes. Previous minutes available from Helen Jowett –helen.jowett@conwy.gov.uk.
There are clearly a number of issues which need further investigation and public consultation before any meaningful decision is made, I have listed some below: -
· As you will be aware there is an acute shortage of public open space in Colwyn Bay and it seems at every turn the council is determined to eat into the little which remains. Can you confirm you have considered the loss of the public amenity the open space currently provides? Will the council be providing replacement open space elsewhere?
If it goes ahead there should not be a loss of public open space.
· Has the loss of open space to the proposed allotments been considered before what is left is further eroded?
See above.
· Given there is no recent use of the site for grazing livestock can you provide confirmation from the Planning Committee that Planning permission is not required for ‘change of use’? Please be aware that ‘intensification of use’ is a material ground for the need to apply for Planning permission.
This is to be checked as part of the feasibility exercise.
· Traffic generation, traffic routes, noise generation are all issues which need to be addressed, what size vehicles will transport the proposed livestock, where will they off-load, where will they turn around? Is the track leading up to Llys Euryn Cottage suitable for livestock wagons?
We envisage small numbers of livestock at limited times but we will need to look into this further.
· Has traffic generation the proposed allotments will generate been considered?
The proposed allotment land is not in the control of our department. Traffic generation may well have been considered by our Environmental Services Department in the drafting of the planning application.
· Will a full Environmental Impact Assessment be carried out to support the proposals?
I don’t think one would be required for this scale of project.
· Will a Health and Safety Audit be carried out to identify the increased risks which will be generated and mitigation measures which will be put in place?
Yes, we would need to look at and modify the existing risk assessment.
· Are maps/drawings available showing your proposals in detail? If not I trust they will be made available for public scrutiny as soon as possible?
There are no maps/drwaings yet.
· What will happen to any money made from grazing licenses, will it just go into the council’s central funds or will it be re-invested in the Bryn?
No money will be made from the grazing licences.
· How much will setting up and maintaining these proposals cost in the council’s bureaucratic costs? Can you prove it will actually be cheaper than contractors mowing the grass?
We will be looking at the costs of different options as part of the process.
· Has the use of voluntary workers to control the grass been considered as an alternative?
As it is a big job to mechanically strim and rake the grassland to a high standard involving trained personnel and there is a limited pool of volunteers, we have found it more cost effective to use a contractor.
· We understand the Bryn is managed in trust by Conwy County Council, could you confirm if this is the case? If so can you provide details of any restrictive covenants which are in place? Presumably the Bryn was left as an amenity for the enjoyment and use of the public, is grazing really compatible?
The Bryn is owned by the Council but it does have a covenant. No business use is permitted on the Bryn, which is why we would not charge for any grazing licence.
We trust the council will behave in an appropriate manner, carrying out public consultation and taking on board the concerns of all users of Bryn Euryn?
We will discuss all issues with the MAG, including your concerns. The MAG will make any decisions on what options to pursue and on what form the public consultation should take.
There is a huge groundswell of public opinion against these proposals and should the council not act entirely transparently in this matter we are sure there will be many wishing to take this case to the Local Authority Ombudsman.
Minutes of the Bryn Euryn Local Nature Reserve Management Advisory Group
Minutes of the Bryn Euryn Local Nature Reserve Management Advisory Group meeting held on Thursday 23rd April 2009 at the Civic Offices,
Colwyn Bay.
Present:
Cllr Dave Roberts (Chairman) (CCBC)
Cllr Philip Edwards (CCBC)
Cllr Roger Parry (CCBC)
Jeff Spencer (Clwyd and Powys Archaeological Trust (CPAT))
Trevor Williams (CCW)
Tom Gravett (Countryside and Rights of Way Manager)
Alun Jones (Countryside Warden)
Mike Klymko (Countryside Student Warden)
Helen Jowett (Senior Countryside Officer)
1. Apologies
Cllr M Thomas (CCBC)
John Osley (Countryside Council for Wales)
Ken Clarke (Colwyn Bay Civic Society)
Mike Yates (Cadw)
2. Matters arising from the minutes of the last meeting
2.1 (2.2) To update, it was reported that the Welsh Assembly has confirmed that there were no objections to the new byelaws during the public consultation period. They have now been sent to Cardiff for confirmation by the Welsh Ministers, and the Legal Section of Conwy Council has requested that this be done as soon as possible, with the hope that the byelaws will be in force in time for the summer.
2.2 (2.3) It was reported that the police CBM that covers the Bryn Euryn area had been very supportive. With it having been a wet summer there were possibly fewer problems than there may have been should the weather have been better. Despite fewer problems it was felt that the police should be encouraged to continue to visit the site.
2.3 (2.4) Tom Gravett had contacted the Parks Section for them to make contact with CPAT regarding an archaeological appraisal of the butt fields after the last meeting; however it appears no direct contact has occurred. There is now a planning application for allotments on the field and members of the group expressed their wish for an archaeological appraisal to occur prior to the allotments being given the go ahead by the Planning Department. Jeff Spencer from CPAT had looked into the history of the fields and from a 1912 map it appeared that the fields were open areas at this time. It was agreed that Jeff Spencer would contact the relevant Planning Officer dealing with the allotment application and also the Parks Department to discuss the opportunity of seeing if there is any archaeological significance to the land. (This land is actually outside of the LNR boundary).
Action: Jeff Spencer to make contact with the Planning Officer dealing with the allotment application on the Butt Fields and also the Parks Department as managers of the land, for all to discuss looking at the archaeology of the area involved.
2.4 (2.5) A new dog bin has been installed in the car park. However there is still no dog bin in by the bottom of the Butt field.
Action: Alun Jones to contact Chris Parry in Cleansing about the installation of a further dog bin and to copy the Parks Department in on any correspondence.
2.5 (3.2) The intention is still to apply for Better Woods for Wales funding for management works within the woodland areas of Bryn Euryn, however there have been delays with this scheme and the application process is proving far more complex than envisaged. The process is ongoing and is being led on by the Coed Cymru Officer within the Countryside Service of CCBC.
The minutes of the last meeting were accepted as a true record.
3. Warden’s report and review of works
Alun Jones, the Countryside Warden, gave a short illustrated presentation covering works that have taken place at the site and the review of works filled in from the management plan was discussed. Issues and points of information arising from these were:
3.1 Further scrub clearance work has been carried out again by contractors around the site. This work is carried out with funding through the Section 15 agreement that Conwy County Borough Council has entered into with the Countryside Council for Wales. The aim of this work is to encourage the growth of the limestone grassland species for which the site is designated a Site of Special Scientific Interest. The lower meadow has been mown each year, and the woodland edges are being slowly pushed back to reduce shade over areas of grassland for which the site is designated an SSSI. Other nature conservation works funded through the section 15 agreement include the removal of invasive species such as the Evergreen Oak, through cutting and herbicide treatment.
3.2 A successful open day was organised at this site in June 2008 as part of Conwy Biodiversity week. Children from Llandrillo School were involved, there were displays within a marquee, traditional countryside crafts on demonstration, storytelling sessions up in the ruins of Llys Euryn, and guided walks during the afternoon. The event provided an opportunity for local people to come and ask questions about the management of the site.
3.3 Trevor Williams indicated in response to the review of works document that grassland survey would next be due to be carried out by CCW in 2010.
3.4 As a point of interest Cllr Roberts mentioned that there are currently 2 parrots being seen on site.
4. Tidy Towns fund – upgrading of some footpaths and site waymarking
4.1 At the last on site informal meeting the idea of upgrading some of the main paths and revamping the waymarker at the site was discussed. In order for this work to take place the Countryside Service applied for £5k from Conwy Council’s allocation of Tidy Towns funding for this year and was successful in its bid. Further funds from within the Countryside Service budget will also go towards this project for this year. Any footpath works will be carried out using materials and methods sympathetic to the natural environment.
It was suggested that for various small projects at this site the Town Council could be approached also in future years.
5. Renewal of section 15 management agreement between the Countryside Council for Wales and CCBC. Feasibility of introducing grazing to the site.
The section 15 agreement between the Countryside Council for Wales and Conwy County Borough Council which provides funding for the nature conservation management works of the SSSI at Bryn Euryn is due for renewal. The new agreement will be for a period of 5 years, providing funding as previously towards mowing some of the calcareous grassland slopes and clearance of invasive species. It will also provide funding towards the possibility of introducing a grazing regime to the site in terms of fencing requirements. It was not felt that sheep would be suitable for the site due to the numbers of dogs exercised at the site, and it would be important for public access to the site to be maintained. There was much group discussion about the idea of introducing grazing ponies or donkeys at Bryn Euryn, with the general consensus being one of support for a grazing regime, as in the long term it is a more sustainable (and cost-effective) way to manage the grasslands than annual mowing and raking off. Any grazing regime would need to be limited to certain numbers of livestock at certain times of year. Fencing to contain livestock may require Scheduled Ancient Monument consent (dependent upon location).
Action: The group agreed to the principle of management through grazing, and that proposals/options be investigated and further considered by the group.
6. Any other business
6.1 Update of year 4 and year 5 for the site management plan.
Helen Jowett explained that whilst the site management plan for Bryn Euryn LNR is completely updated every 5 years, the year by year projects at the back currently run up to year 3 of the plan, being 2008/2009. Therefore projects specific to years 2009/2010 and 2210/2011 were discussed by the group.
Action: It was agreed that the Senior Countryside Officer would send out a sheet of the year 4 and year 5 projects for members to insert into their copies of the management plan for the site.
6.2 Monitoring of trees alongside the A55
Cllr Parry questioned whether there was any monitoring of the trees carried out alongside the A55 in response to the volume of traffic. No one was aware of any monitoring of this kind.
7. Date of next meeting
Unless there is a need to call a meeting sooner, the next meeting will be held informally on site in September 2009. A precise date will be arranged nearer the time.
Colwyn Bay.
Present:
Cllr Dave Roberts (Chairman) (CCBC)
Cllr Philip Edwards (CCBC)
Cllr Roger Parry (CCBC)
Jeff Spencer (Clwyd and Powys Archaeological Trust (CPAT))
Trevor Williams (CCW)
Tom Gravett (Countryside and Rights of Way Manager)
Alun Jones (Countryside Warden)
Mike Klymko (Countryside Student Warden)
Helen Jowett (Senior Countryside Officer)
1. Apologies
Cllr M Thomas (CCBC)
John Osley (Countryside Council for Wales)
Ken Clarke (Colwyn Bay Civic Society)
Mike Yates (Cadw)
2. Matters arising from the minutes of the last meeting
2.1 (2.2) To update, it was reported that the Welsh Assembly has confirmed that there were no objections to the new byelaws during the public consultation period. They have now been sent to Cardiff for confirmation by the Welsh Ministers, and the Legal Section of Conwy Council has requested that this be done as soon as possible, with the hope that the byelaws will be in force in time for the summer.
2.2 (2.3) It was reported that the police CBM that covers the Bryn Euryn area had been very supportive. With it having been a wet summer there were possibly fewer problems than there may have been should the weather have been better. Despite fewer problems it was felt that the police should be encouraged to continue to visit the site.
2.3 (2.4) Tom Gravett had contacted the Parks Section for them to make contact with CPAT regarding an archaeological appraisal of the butt fields after the last meeting; however it appears no direct contact has occurred. There is now a planning application for allotments on the field and members of the group expressed their wish for an archaeological appraisal to occur prior to the allotments being given the go ahead by the Planning Department. Jeff Spencer from CPAT had looked into the history of the fields and from a 1912 map it appeared that the fields were open areas at this time. It was agreed that Jeff Spencer would contact the relevant Planning Officer dealing with the allotment application and also the Parks Department to discuss the opportunity of seeing if there is any archaeological significance to the land. (This land is actually outside of the LNR boundary).
Action: Jeff Spencer to make contact with the Planning Officer dealing with the allotment application on the Butt Fields and also the Parks Department as managers of the land, for all to discuss looking at the archaeology of the area involved.
2.4 (2.5) A new dog bin has been installed in the car park. However there is still no dog bin in by the bottom of the Butt field.
Action: Alun Jones to contact Chris Parry in Cleansing about the installation of a further dog bin and to copy the Parks Department in on any correspondence.
2.5 (3.2) The intention is still to apply for Better Woods for Wales funding for management works within the woodland areas of Bryn Euryn, however there have been delays with this scheme and the application process is proving far more complex than envisaged. The process is ongoing and is being led on by the Coed Cymru Officer within the Countryside Service of CCBC.
The minutes of the last meeting were accepted as a true record.
3. Warden’s report and review of works
Alun Jones, the Countryside Warden, gave a short illustrated presentation covering works that have taken place at the site and the review of works filled in from the management plan was discussed. Issues and points of information arising from these were:
3.1 Further scrub clearance work has been carried out again by contractors around the site. This work is carried out with funding through the Section 15 agreement that Conwy County Borough Council has entered into with the Countryside Council for Wales. The aim of this work is to encourage the growth of the limestone grassland species for which the site is designated a Site of Special Scientific Interest. The lower meadow has been mown each year, and the woodland edges are being slowly pushed back to reduce shade over areas of grassland for which the site is designated an SSSI. Other nature conservation works funded through the section 15 agreement include the removal of invasive species such as the Evergreen Oak, through cutting and herbicide treatment.
3.2 A successful open day was organised at this site in June 2008 as part of Conwy Biodiversity week. Children from Llandrillo School were involved, there were displays within a marquee, traditional countryside crafts on demonstration, storytelling sessions up in the ruins of Llys Euryn, and guided walks during the afternoon. The event provided an opportunity for local people to come and ask questions about the management of the site.
3.3 Trevor Williams indicated in response to the review of works document that grassland survey would next be due to be carried out by CCW in 2010.
3.4 As a point of interest Cllr Roberts mentioned that there are currently 2 parrots being seen on site.
4. Tidy Towns fund – upgrading of some footpaths and site waymarking
4.1 At the last on site informal meeting the idea of upgrading some of the main paths and revamping the waymarker at the site was discussed. In order for this work to take place the Countryside Service applied for £5k from Conwy Council’s allocation of Tidy Towns funding for this year and was successful in its bid. Further funds from within the Countryside Service budget will also go towards this project for this year. Any footpath works will be carried out using materials and methods sympathetic to the natural environment.
It was suggested that for various small projects at this site the Town Council could be approached also in future years.
5. Renewal of section 15 management agreement between the Countryside Council for Wales and CCBC. Feasibility of introducing grazing to the site.
The section 15 agreement between the Countryside Council for Wales and Conwy County Borough Council which provides funding for the nature conservation management works of the SSSI at Bryn Euryn is due for renewal. The new agreement will be for a period of 5 years, providing funding as previously towards mowing some of the calcareous grassland slopes and clearance of invasive species. It will also provide funding towards the possibility of introducing a grazing regime to the site in terms of fencing requirements. It was not felt that sheep would be suitable for the site due to the numbers of dogs exercised at the site, and it would be important for public access to the site to be maintained. There was much group discussion about the idea of introducing grazing ponies or donkeys at Bryn Euryn, with the general consensus being one of support for a grazing regime, as in the long term it is a more sustainable (and cost-effective) way to manage the grasslands than annual mowing and raking off. Any grazing regime would need to be limited to certain numbers of livestock at certain times of year. Fencing to contain livestock may require Scheduled Ancient Monument consent (dependent upon location).
Action: The group agreed to the principle of management through grazing, and that proposals/options be investigated and further considered by the group.
6. Any other business
6.1 Update of year 4 and year 5 for the site management plan.
Helen Jowett explained that whilst the site management plan for Bryn Euryn LNR is completely updated every 5 years, the year by year projects at the back currently run up to year 3 of the plan, being 2008/2009. Therefore projects specific to years 2009/2010 and 2210/2011 were discussed by the group.
Action: It was agreed that the Senior Countryside Officer would send out a sheet of the year 4 and year 5 projects for members to insert into their copies of the management plan for the site.
6.2 Monitoring of trees alongside the A55
Cllr Parry questioned whether there was any monitoring of the trees carried out alongside the A55 in response to the volume of traffic. No one was aware of any monitoring of this kind.
7. Date of next meeting
Unless there is a need to call a meeting sooner, the next meeting will be held informally on site in September 2009. A precise date will be arranged nearer the time.
Tuesday 23 June 2009
Hands off Bryn Euryn
Following his press release yesterday David Jones MP has added a fine post on his blog site which sums up the feelings of many of our dog walking supports: -
http://davidjonesblog.com/2009/06/22/hands-off-bryn-euryn/#comments
Not that its just the dog owners who are concerned, many families with children will be attending Saturday's meeting to voice their concerns over changes to this much needed open space.
http://davidjonesblog.com/2009/06/22/hands-off-bryn-euryn/#comments
Not that its just the dog owners who are concerned, many families with children will be attending Saturday's meeting to voice their concerns over changes to this much needed open space.
Monday 22 June 2009
Press Release from David Jones MP
Many thanks to the local MP for such great support on such a busy day in Parliament!
News Release
HANDS OFF BRYN EURYN
FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
Westminster, 22 June, 2009
Clwyd West MP, David Jones, will address a public meeting on Saturday, 27 June, to protest at council proposals to turn over part of the Bryn Euryn Nature Reserve, Rhos on Sea, to grazing.
Under plans announce by the reserve’s management committee, livestock will be put on the land for up to four months of the year.
David Jones said:
“Bryn Euryn is a valued local facility, popular with walkers, especially those with dogs. I have walked there with my own dog, and can well understand the concern of local residents.
“I strongly suspect that the proposal is an attempt to save the cost of strimming and to recover some revenue by way of rent.
“I will be attending the meeting on Saturday to draw attention to public concern over this misconceived proposal.
“We are living in gloomy enough times, without being deprived of valued recreational facilities.
“I very much hope that the reserve’s management committee will take note of the public concern and drop this extremely unpopular plan.”
ENDS
Note to editors:
The public meeting will take place at the Nature Reserve car park at 10.30 a.m. on Saturday, 27 June.
News Release
HANDS OFF BRYN EURYN
FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
Westminster, 22 June, 2009
Clwyd West MP, David Jones, will address a public meeting on Saturday, 27 June, to protest at council proposals to turn over part of the Bryn Euryn Nature Reserve, Rhos on Sea, to grazing.
Under plans announce by the reserve’s management committee, livestock will be put on the land for up to four months of the year.
David Jones said:
“Bryn Euryn is a valued local facility, popular with walkers, especially those with dogs. I have walked there with my own dog, and can well understand the concern of local residents.
“I strongly suspect that the proposal is an attempt to save the cost of strimming and to recover some revenue by way of rent.
“I will be attending the meeting on Saturday to draw attention to public concern over this misconceived proposal.
“We are living in gloomy enough times, without being deprived of valued recreational facilities.
“I very much hope that the reserve’s management committee will take note of the public concern and drop this extremely unpopular plan.”
ENDS
Note to editors:
The public meeting will take place at the Nature Reserve car park at 10.30 a.m. on Saturday, 27 June.
Woman killed by stampeding cattle
You may have seen this tradgic storey of a dog walker killed by cattle.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/north_yorkshire/8112048.stm
Hopefully this sad incident will make Conwy council think again about their mad scheme to turn the open fields of the Bryn over to grazing.
Have they considered the impact and risks having livestock grazing public areas will have on children and the elderly not just the large number of dog walkers all of whom use the Bryn?
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/north_yorkshire/8112048.stm
Hopefully this sad incident will make Conwy council think again about their mad scheme to turn the open fields of the Bryn over to grazing.
Have they considered the impact and risks having livestock grazing public areas will have on children and the elderly not just the large number of dog walkers all of whom use the Bryn?
Turn Up To Show Your Support
Save Our Bryn supporters are pleased to announce that the Rt. Hon. David Jones, local MP and user of the Bryn, has taken a personal interest in our struggle to prevent the council using the fields on the Bryn for grazing.
A public meeting has been arranged for this Saturday, 27th June at 10:30AM in the car park at the top of Rhos Road.
David Jones will be attending along with the local press. We need a big turn out to show the council the huge number of people against their plans to ruin the unique public open space which is Bryn Euryn.
If you care about saving the Bryn please make the effort to join us.
See you there
A public meeting has been arranged for this Saturday, 27th June at 10:30AM in the car park at the top of Rhos Road.
David Jones will be attending along with the local press. We need a big turn out to show the council the huge number of people against their plans to ruin the unique public open space which is Bryn Euryn.
If you care about saving the Bryn please make the effort to join us.
See you there
Sunday 21 June 2009
Share your letters & emails!
If you have any email, letters or replys you would like to share then feel free to send to: -
save.our.bryn@hotmail.co.uk
save.our.bryn@hotmail.co.uk
Email to the Warden
The email below has been sent to the warden by a supporter, any reply will be posted...
Alun
Further to the excellent article on the front page of today’s North Wales Pioneer I would be grateful if you could clarify a few points: -
What evidence do you have of recent grazing by livestock? To my own recollection, backed up by several others, there has been no grazing on the Bryn for the last 50 years. If no evidence of recent grazing can be provided will a public apology be forthcoming?
Why have contractors been used for the last ten years to mow the land, has this been an artificial attempt to promote the calcareous grasslands?
If no decision has been made, who will make the decision, what timescales do you have, what public consultation do you intend to carryout, what other alternatives to grazing have you considered?
You are quoted as saying grazing will be more environmentally friendly in the long run, what criteria have you used to assess the environmental impact? Have you quantified the carbon footprint of transporting livestock to of from site twice a year, carrying materials to form the ‘paddocks’, transporting feed, visits by the livestock owner to inspect their stock? How does this compare to the limited impact of mowing once a year.
How do you proposed to create paddocks without fences, just gates? Will gates provided be suitable for the disabled and families with pushchairs?
Regards the management committee Cllr Edwards is a member of, I would be grateful if you could provide the following: -
· Terms of reference for the committee
· Full list of members with contact addresses
· Details of how members are appointed and how concerned and interested members of the public can apply to join the committee
· Details of how often the committee meets, date of next meeting, agenda and facilities for members of the public to attend?
· Where can minutes of past meetings can be found?
There are clearly a number of issues which need further investigation and public consultation before any meaningful decision is made, I have listed some below: -
· As you will be aware there is an acute shortage of public open space in Colwyn Bay and it seems at every turn the council is determined to eat into the little which remains. Can you confirm you have considered the loss of the public amenity the open space currently provides? Will the council be providing replacement open space elsewhere?
· Has the loss of open space to the proposed allotments been considered before what is left is further eroded?
· Given there is no recent use of the site for grazing livestock can you provide confirmation from the Planning Committee that Planning permission is not required for ‘change of use’? Please be aware that ‘intensification of use’ is a material ground for the need to apply for Planning permission.
· Traffic generation, traffic routes, noise generation are all issues which need to be addressed, what size vehicles will transport the proposed livestock, where will they off-load, where will they turn around? Is the track leading up to Llys Euryn Cottage suitable for livestock wagons?
· Has traffic generation the proposed allotments will generate been considered?
· Will a full Environmental Impact Assessment be carried out to support the proposals?
· Will a Health and Safety Audit be carried out to identify the increased risks which will be generated and mitigation measures which will be put in place?
· Are maps/drawings available showing your proposals in detail? If not I trust they will be made available for public scrutiny as soon as possible?
· What will happen to any money made from grazing licenses, will it just go into the council’s central funds or will it be re-invested in the Bryn?
· How much will setting up and maintaining these proposals cost in the council’s bureaucratic costs? Can you prove it will actually be cheaper than contractors mowing the grass?
· Has the use of voluntary workers to control the grass been considered as an alternative?
· I understand the Bryn is managed in trust by Conwy County Council, could you confirm if this is the case? If so can you provide details of any restrictive covenants which are in place?
Presumably the Bryn was left as a amenity for the enjoyment and use of the public, is grazing really compatible?
I trust the council will behave in an appropriate manner, carrying out public consultation and taking on board the concerns of all users of Bryn Euryn?
There is a huge groundswell of public opinion against these proposals and should the council not act entirely transparently in this matter I am sure there will be many wishing to take this case to the Local Authority Ombudsman.
Alun
Further to the excellent article on the front page of today’s North Wales Pioneer I would be grateful if you could clarify a few points: -
What evidence do you have of recent grazing by livestock? To my own recollection, backed up by several others, there has been no grazing on the Bryn for the last 50 years. If no evidence of recent grazing can be provided will a public apology be forthcoming?
Why have contractors been used for the last ten years to mow the land, has this been an artificial attempt to promote the calcareous grasslands?
If no decision has been made, who will make the decision, what timescales do you have, what public consultation do you intend to carryout, what other alternatives to grazing have you considered?
You are quoted as saying grazing will be more environmentally friendly in the long run, what criteria have you used to assess the environmental impact? Have you quantified the carbon footprint of transporting livestock to of from site twice a year, carrying materials to form the ‘paddocks’, transporting feed, visits by the livestock owner to inspect their stock? How does this compare to the limited impact of mowing once a year.
How do you proposed to create paddocks without fences, just gates? Will gates provided be suitable for the disabled and families with pushchairs?
Regards the management committee Cllr Edwards is a member of, I would be grateful if you could provide the following: -
· Terms of reference for the committee
· Full list of members with contact addresses
· Details of how members are appointed and how concerned and interested members of the public can apply to join the committee
· Details of how often the committee meets, date of next meeting, agenda and facilities for members of the public to attend?
· Where can minutes of past meetings can be found?
There are clearly a number of issues which need further investigation and public consultation before any meaningful decision is made, I have listed some below: -
· As you will be aware there is an acute shortage of public open space in Colwyn Bay and it seems at every turn the council is determined to eat into the little which remains. Can you confirm you have considered the loss of the public amenity the open space currently provides? Will the council be providing replacement open space elsewhere?
· Has the loss of open space to the proposed allotments been considered before what is left is further eroded?
· Given there is no recent use of the site for grazing livestock can you provide confirmation from the Planning Committee that Planning permission is not required for ‘change of use’? Please be aware that ‘intensification of use’ is a material ground for the need to apply for Planning permission.
· Traffic generation, traffic routes, noise generation are all issues which need to be addressed, what size vehicles will transport the proposed livestock, where will they off-load, where will they turn around? Is the track leading up to Llys Euryn Cottage suitable for livestock wagons?
· Has traffic generation the proposed allotments will generate been considered?
· Will a full Environmental Impact Assessment be carried out to support the proposals?
· Will a Health and Safety Audit be carried out to identify the increased risks which will be generated and mitigation measures which will be put in place?
· Are maps/drawings available showing your proposals in detail? If not I trust they will be made available for public scrutiny as soon as possible?
· What will happen to any money made from grazing licenses, will it just go into the council’s central funds or will it be re-invested in the Bryn?
· How much will setting up and maintaining these proposals cost in the council’s bureaucratic costs? Can you prove it will actually be cheaper than contractors mowing the grass?
· Has the use of voluntary workers to control the grass been considered as an alternative?
· I understand the Bryn is managed in trust by Conwy County Council, could you confirm if this is the case? If so can you provide details of any restrictive covenants which are in place?
Presumably the Bryn was left as a amenity for the enjoyment and use of the public, is grazing really compatible?
I trust the council will behave in an appropriate manner, carrying out public consultation and taking on board the concerns of all users of Bryn Euryn?
There is a huge groundswell of public opinion against these proposals and should the council not act entirely transparently in this matter I am sure there will be many wishing to take this case to the Local Authority Ombudsman.
Friday 19 June 2009
Get your letters and emails sent off
If you have concerns then now is the time to act, we all need to start writing letters and emails to the local papers, Councillors, AM and even the MP!
Email Address Sent Up
If you want to join the many people concerned about the future of the Bryn and its protection you can contact us at: -
save.our.bryn@hotmail.co.uk
A mailing list will be created and updates sent out as we get any news.
save.our.bryn@hotmail.co.uk
A mailing list will be created and updates sent out as we get any news.
Front page of the North Wales Poineer!
Rhos on Sea Dog Walkers Grassed Off
Published Date: 17 June 2009
By Anna Glover
CONCERNED dog walkers fear a local historic beauty spot could be filled with grazing livestock.
At a recent meeting of Bryn Euryn Nature Reserve's Management Committee, Rhos on Sea, members discussed protecting a rare form of grass which grows at the site. Suggestions included placing animals on upper land to encourage the grass to grow.
Dog walkers gathered at the site this week, to object to the proposals. Susan Davies, who regularly uses the site to walk her dog, feared ponies and horses would be introduced to the grassland. She said: "I am extremely angry by the total lack of consultation the people of Rhos and all other interested parties have received. Until recent years the Bryn was never strimmed yet still managed to attain SSSI status.
"I thought the area had been given to the council for the people not for fences and gates to be put all over it. My kids have loved the freedom to play there and sledge at the first signs of snow. The dog walking community gather and chat, clubs, schools and colleges use it without having to consider livestock."
Some areas of Bryn Euryn attained Site of Special Scientific Interest (SSSI) due to the rare limestone grass.
Alun Jones, warden for the area, said the grass was originally maintained by grazing livestock, but over the last ten years contractors have been brought in to mow the land. He said: "No decisions have been made, but if it goes ahead we are only looking at four months of the year. It would be more environmentally friendly in the long run. There would be two paddocks of livestock, we are thinking of sheep, ponies or donkeys.
"There would be no fences just gates and public access. We will take people's views on board nothing has been decided. We are not seeking to curb dog walkers. I can understand why they are upset. We would ask them to keep them on a lead and then let them run free outside the paddocks."
Rhos on Sea councillor, Phil Edwards, who is on the management committee for the reserve, said grazing livestock was part of the natural cycle and would encourage the rare grass to grow.
http://www.northwalespioneer.co.uk/news/Rhos-on-Sea-Dog-Walkers.5372763.jp
Published Date: 17 June 2009
By Anna Glover
CONCERNED dog walkers fear a local historic beauty spot could be filled with grazing livestock.
At a recent meeting of Bryn Euryn Nature Reserve's Management Committee, Rhos on Sea, members discussed protecting a rare form of grass which grows at the site. Suggestions included placing animals on upper land to encourage the grass to grow.
Dog walkers gathered at the site this week, to object to the proposals. Susan Davies, who regularly uses the site to walk her dog, feared ponies and horses would be introduced to the grassland. She said: "I am extremely angry by the total lack of consultation the people of Rhos and all other interested parties have received. Until recent years the Bryn was never strimmed yet still managed to attain SSSI status.
"I thought the area had been given to the council for the people not for fences and gates to be put all over it. My kids have loved the freedom to play there and sledge at the first signs of snow. The dog walking community gather and chat, clubs, schools and colleges use it without having to consider livestock."
Some areas of Bryn Euryn attained Site of Special Scientific Interest (SSSI) due to the rare limestone grass.
Alun Jones, warden for the area, said the grass was originally maintained by grazing livestock, but over the last ten years contractors have been brought in to mow the land. He said: "No decisions have been made, but if it goes ahead we are only looking at four months of the year. It would be more environmentally friendly in the long run. There would be two paddocks of livestock, we are thinking of sheep, ponies or donkeys.
"There would be no fences just gates and public access. We will take people's views on board nothing has been decided. We are not seeking to curb dog walkers. I can understand why they are upset. We would ask them to keep them on a lead and then let them run free outside the paddocks."
Rhos on Sea councillor, Phil Edwards, who is on the management committee for the reserve, said grazing livestock was part of the natural cycle and would encourage the rare grass to grow.
http://www.northwalespioneer.co.uk/news/Rhos-on-Sea-Dog-Walkers.5372763.jp
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